first of all he said to him you know how
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here in Tampa Florida in front of the
future Dean Center which would be the
first mega dawa Center in America
brothers and sisters Allah has
privileged you and I with the truth and
this is an opportunity for us to do a
prophet's work and earn a prophet's
reward the prophet Muhammad sallallahu
alaihi wasallam said that this is a
matter that will reach every home and
now is your opportunity to be involved
in such a thing that the prophet
Muhammad
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all of you Bismillah alhamdulillah
peace welcome to the deanstrom at your
host subscribe if you haven't already so
you don't miss exciting episodes shows
like this well my next guest Ismail
Bullock brother smiles from the UK and
was brought up in the suburbs of ispen
Surrey he accepted Islam in 1991 while
at school get this while at school at
the age of 14 after seeing a few muslims
praying in a classroom
after accepting Islam submission to the
crater not the creation he began to
learn by attending regular classes and
seminars visiting with and learning from
major Scholars he has a ba in Islamic
Studies in the M.A in dawah he also has
his own weekly Islamic show called guest
of the week on sarja TV currently he
works as the head of dawa for the
Islamic information center in Dubai and
that's where he met our brother Andrew
Tate let's learn more about this and
more with our brother Ismail Bullock
how you doing brother Ismail how are you
doing how you been
good to be on the dean show we you know
we've all watched it now and again over
all these years so it's nice to nice to
be on with you martial law it's nice to
have you on alhamdulillah so uh we've
got a lot to talk about
um let's let's start off with uh so you
work as the head of dawa here at the uh
Islamic Educational Institute in Dubai
Islamic information center in Dubai
that's correct yes yeah we see how
important it is getting the right
information now education so you're uh
how long you've been there
I've been there just for about four and
a half years now
let's get right into this uh video you
can kind of break this down for us and
we'll go from there
[Music]
is it every day you get a surprise visit
like this in uh not every day the thing
is we actually
like everybody we you know we'd uh heard
that Andrew Taylor become Muslim I'll be
quite honest with you that I'd seen him
I'd seen him as a figure on the net but
I can I can't say that I personally had
like watched lots of his stuff but I
knew that he was a person that many
people look up to from certain
perspectives especially the the masking
inside of things so when we heard he
became a Muslim
and I was familiar with Tam Khan as you
obviously you had him recently on your
show
um I knew of him so I had a we had a
mutual friend and actually maybe a
person you know because obviously as
everybody knows you're you're into Jiu
Jitsu and I um happened to be a blue
belt which needs which I need to go back
I need to go back into practice though
but we have a mutual friend a very
well-known person here called Amin he is
the owner of the Hoist Gracie Academy in
Dubai
um so we have we have this mutual friend
we both know you know he knows Tam Khan
and I know him so I reached out to him I
said him look
agitators become a Muslim he's a very
well-known figure if you like to call
controversial whatever it may be but he
has a massive audience he has a massive
impact on people so we said it's very
important that now he's become a Muslim
we try to reach out and try to say to
him like we are here for you I mean just
in the name you know Islamic Information
Center shows that we're like a a
One-Stop Center for information on Islam
so we thought it's very important for
him to come and sit down with us for us
to chat with him so we reached out and
we said you know would you like to come
in and Tam said you actually would
because we've had so many and I'm still
seeing that to today so many people are
doubting that he's become a Muslim or
sane it's not real it's propaganda or he
was just trying out the prayer and
unfortunately many Muslims are even
saying that and saying even as you
probably know even crazier things so he
said we'd love to come down and we'd
love to film it so we were like that's
absolutely fine he said because we want
to show them not only has become you
know he's praying and he's clearly said
he's become a Muslim but look he's even
going to an Islamic Center now to get
more information so they came down and
had that meeting with us
so we so it's safe to say officially I
mean it was confirmed with our brother
Tam Khan who was recently on the show
but now you head of dawa there in Dubai
he comes into the center what was that
conversation like
yeah of course first of all we said to
him you know how do you feel being
Muslim and of course he said oh it's
amazing you know I become a Muslim so
you know there's no doubt about this you
know that's official so it's official
official yeah I I've seen something I
think coming out a day or two ago of
another show but I think that was
recorded probably before he took shahada
so yeah like I said he sat with us for
like maybe 30 45 minutes it wasn't like
a five minute meeting and we the whole
thing we were talking about him becoming
a Muslim and what led him to that and we
also told him as well you know you have
such a big platform so now that
shouldn't be the way things work but the
fact that you're a Muslim now people
will judge Islam by you and we always
tell everybody don't judge Islam by
Muslims Islam is perfect Muslims aren't
but unfortunately though in the world we
live in that's not how it works and we
know that from you know uh how Islam has
always been judged by certain people or
certain actions that are done that
aren't from Islam so we told him you
have a very big responsibility now you
have so many people look up to you so we
advised him to use his platform in the
best possible way he can you know for
for positive uh positive message
and obviously you guys now he he knows
the six articles of Faith the five
pillars of Islam all just basic stuff he
pretty much everything is made clear to
him obviously that's right and what we
have at the center I mean I'll probably
when you're ready I can elaborate a bit
more what we do in the center but in our
Center we have an online Academy it's
literally Academy dot Islamic ic.com uh
and that is literally uh we have a new
Muslim course level one a new Muslim
course level two uh we're working on
level three so you could say someone can
go from the very Basics even to Advanced
and that's all online it's all free of
charge we even have a getting ready for
married life course we have a a course
that your first Ramadan and to be honest
these courses are even good for the
average Muslim they're very very nice
courses and we got starve Muhammad Tim
humble which is he's very well known
he's the one who's giving those recorded
lessons so we gave him that as well we
recommended him he's a very busy man
he's really busy lifestyle we told him
at least try and spend you know a day or
every day watching one of these videos
to continue your Learning Journey I mean
this is so important education is so
important I mean obviously someone takes
the first step acknowledges what's in
their fit through their nature that
there's nothing worthy of worship except
the creator of Heaven's on Earth God
Almighty Allah and then they start to
establish all based on on knowledge
evidence Islam is a evidence-based
religion way of life it's not blind
faith and it's it's not like you have so
many man-made religions but Andrew Tate
he got to see through all of this he got
to see many of the the um the moral code
of Islam you know he loved that he talks
a lot about that he talks about so many
of the things that are set up in Islam
that just it goes with the the nature of
the human being but then this most
important thing about establishing a
direct connection with your creator I
mean this this this overshadows
everything this is the foundation the
pillar I mean this is uh the tohi the
pure monotheism so how um how was it uh
you know and then the love for Jesus you
know when when people like yourself you
know you were seeing muslims praying and
then we saw Andrew Tate also praying
this video that got out and when anyone
who just can makes those connections
that's how Jesus peace be on upon him
pray so we're seeing that Jesus
worshiped God Alone he prayed like he
prayed he was praying like Jesus you saw
muslims praying like Jesus you know when
these things come together it's just
easy to digest it's not hard to
comprehend and it's easy to fall in line
with this
exactly I mean like you said I mean the
one of the main things that at such a
young age attracted me to Islam was
seeing some of my Muslim um
school friends uh praying which was a
big surprise because you know
unfortunately uh you know especially in
the west we don't think of prayer and we
don't think about that as a teenager so
to see these Muslims pray and to be
honest they weren't necessarily people
they would always pray but they used to
pray Friday prayer and seeing them
praying and seeing them bowing down and
there's no images there's no Idols or
anything like that was what really
struck me and I remember saying to them
I'm interested and you know initially
they were like yeah whatever I said no
no I'm actually interested so they were
very limited in their knowledge and
what's quite funny is they the first
thing they did is they wrote down on a
piece of paper for me and they said you
must take this piece of paper and read
it every single day so much and it
literally was in English letters of
course subhanallah alhamdulillah
and they're like this one you have to do
a lot because you're not a Muslim so
they did their best but I mean they took
me to the mosque and I actually joined
in the I made that was an amazing
feeling for the first time and they
actually joined the prayer and I still
remember being a 14 almost 15 year old
that that whole thing of going down in
prostration
which is an amazing feeling and
obviously as now as we've become Muslim
we've learned more it really you realize
you know you're saying in that you're in
that prostration
that place you know the person's face
the person's head is a usually a thing
of pride a thing of vanity you know
you've got that on the floor it's kind
of the lowest you can be as a human
really in submission and what are you
saying at your lowest point you're
saying sapana
to my Lord who is the most high so this
is it was an amazing feeling and after
that I became a Muslim and you know that
was just the beginning of a long journey
that we're we're still on and we make
you know we ask Allah that we continue
on this journey until we die
and that's the beautiful thing Islam is
a is evidence-based way of life and
based on authentic evidence from the
preservation of the Quran you have the
prophecies the scientific Miracles I
mean no room left for any doubt that
this is indeed from the creator of the
heavens and the Earth uh believable
message everything falls in line and you
wouldn't have gotten to where you are
today the the head of the dawah academy
there really growing in your Deen if you
weren't dedicated to learning so Andrew
Tate also has a great opportunity here
and many of the new reverts converts who
come in how important it is to really
really spend time learning your Dean so
you can grow in it
definitely definitely I mean we know
that that is what is another I mean when
it comes to Islam everything is so
unique you know but I mean
even the concept of knowledge we we know
in in you know we may have been told
maybe it's growing up just believe in
this or you know God works in mysterious
ways and you don't need to know you
don't need to ask and you know we always
say and always say to everybody when it
comes to the belief the essential Creed
or essential you know I guess you could
say pillar of Faith or statement or a
central belief for you to be to attain
salvation it has to be easy for everyone
to understand it has to be whether
you're you know you're as intelligent as
Einstein or you're just a very simple
person with a with a simple intellect it
has to be something that everyone
because it you know the Creator Allah
almighty God he created all of us so the
the faith that we have to believe in and
the essential belief which we know as
Muslims is
that there is nothing worthy of worship
except Allah and the prophet Muhammad is
his final messenger this has to be
understood whereas you may see other
Concepts whether they're Trinity
whatever it may be that you can't make
sense of and we're just told to like
don't worry about that just believe
whereas we know that the the essential
thing of our Salvation must be
comprehendable must be it's from the
from the child to that to the adult from
their most intellectual from the most
simplest person
they must be able to understand this
because they otherwise they themselves
cannot attain salvation so this is this
is the beauty of Islam and Islam
encourages us you know we know that
Prophet Muhammad it's not like other
things will be told don't delve too deep
don't study just follow the clergy just
follow the sheikhs or the imams no we
are encouraged the prophet Muhammad
peace behind him as we as we all know he
said that uh seeking knowledge is
obligatory upon every male and female
and so many so many Hadith where he you
know he mentioned the reward of the one
who gets knowledge uh to encourage them
and there's this whole emphasis even
Allah says no
that Allah is your lord so it's not just
Blind Faith but no you know there
there's this encouragement where this is
completely opposite to most you know
other religions where you're just told
to you know believe and that's it don't
delve don't ask don't don't don't search
and don't learn
uh no how are you gonna know if you
don't study if you don't learn if you
don't grow it reminds me of the Hadith
where the Prophet Muhammad peace of
blessed to be upon him and if you can
elaborate on this this authentic Hadith
where he talks about what's heavier
on shaytan then a you can have
paraphrasing Hadith a thousand
worshipers but the the Learned person is
much more heavier on shaytan than a
thousand worshipers or more
that's right because you know you can
have a person who worships and an
example that comes to mind when you say
that is that famous Hadith or a man who
killed 100 killed 99 people and then he
was trying to find a way can I make Toba
repentance from this and he went to a
uh
someone who was a worshiper and the
person basically said to him no you know
you cannot
you know make Toba so he killed him oh
no knowledge yeah yeah and then he came
he came to another person who told him
that you know that is told by so this is
this is what we see and you if you see
what the scholars as well what they say
is they say like what is better is it
the person who is a constant worshiper
and what was she talking about we're not
talking about the obligatory worship of
course we're talking about the one who
goes the extra mile in worship who is
better the water goes to extra mining
worship so maybe he's waking up every
single day
and maybe he's every other day he's
fasting who is better him or the one who
is the scholar or the one who's
knowledgeable who maybe has less but has
more knowledge and all the scholars say
is the one who has knowledge because in
reality
how can you know the truth if you don't
know falsehood how can you know what is
tohed the Oneness of Allah if you don't
know what he should so you may have a
person who's very Pious and very
worships a lot but he's lacking
essential religion and he can end up
falling into some of these you know
things like associating things with
Allah like Innovation so this is why you
know the the knowledge knowledge is so
so important so tell me uh were you also
like Andrew Tate he came from a
Christian background were you also from
a Christian background just like Andrew
that's great yeah on my um my mother's
side of the family or Roman Catholic and
my uh Father's Side Church of England
which is basically a four month note
Protestant so um I had a fairly I
wouldn't say I had a religious
upbringing but my I spent a lot of time
with my grandparents and my grandfather
was quite active in the church uh I
forget what they call them but he was
one of the people who uh we had what we
call the vicar like the father and they
would have people who would walk behind
him like maybe carrying a a big candle
stick and taking part you know assisting
him in some of the the practices so he
was quite active doing that every Sunday
so I did have that was part of my life
growing up but like the majority of
people in the west you know we weren't
uh particularly over religious well I
had good exposure you could say to to
the Christian religion
and what was it at that point you're 14
years old and now you're seeing Muslims
pray did you have any prior knowledge of
Islam up until then what was your
understanding
the thing is we we were just religious
education but before I can remember
until now it's Paula something sticking
your mind is that I can remember the
textbook and it would have like a
picture of Ahmed he comes home from
school his mother based upon maybe the
the majority of Muslims in the UK so for
example his mother Pakistani so she's
looking like a Pakistani in this book
she's wearing Pakistani dress Ahmed
comes home his mother makes for him a
Paratha and some Curry so it's a very
Indian Pakistani kind of thing that's
coming across so at that stage you may
not necessarily from back then anyway
maybe it's improved now unless you're
really really interested in studying
religion which most of us you know lots
of classes as teenagers you're not maybe
paying too much attention you're not
going to really differentiate between
what they're telling you there for
example and maybe Hinduism or another
what looks like Indian subcontinent as
we know and as you know of course better
than me we have a very strong white
European Islam we have you know bosnians
we have kosovans but you know they were
choosing what they see in the UK
especially back then which was mostly
Pakistani so I didn't really have any
idea what Islam really was it's only
when I saw them praying it got me more
interested and I remember going to my
grandfather's house and had this book
called um the Reader's Digest which is a
publication a lot of them are factual
the world book of facts a very big book
which has all kind of statistics and
they had a section on religion and I
remember at such a young age when I look
back now I say wow how did I do such a
decision at the age of 14 especially
when we see 14 year olds in this modern
time they're all 24 hours gaming and
consoles and we were a bit different
back in that time
um yes I remember going and reading this
we just digest and even at such a young
age when I would read about each
religion of course there may be some
each religion has some aspect that kind
of said oh that sounds interesting that
sounds good or but I remember what
really struck out about Islam was the
fact that it said you know Islam believe
in one true God Allah that he is the
Creator he's the only one who deserves
worship and he is the only
um
uh only himself you don't need to go
through any intermediaries you don't
need to pray to anybody and that just
said I mean even at a young age I just
said to myself that just makes complete
sense you know he has no image you know
there's no images of him
everything I could think of it just said
that sounds like how almighty God the
creator of the heavens and the Earth
how it should sound you know and
subhanallah so that was the kind of what
you know made the decision and to be
fair back then I did get hold of but I
think by then it was pretty much the
time that I decided I wanted to become a
Muslim it just made so much sense but
took sense but to kind of cement that
belief I was given I think some Ahmad
books like there is Bible is the is the
Bible God's word and Muhammad in the
Bible and other things like that and
that just kind of you know as a as a new
Muslim you could say is a bit like a
baby in that sense this was what really
gave me the uh these things and reading
more was really what just made me even
more firm in my decision I realized you
know that this was the this was the
right decision and I say to so many
people over the years before I work
where I work now I worked for Dubai
government exhibition and we had many
tourists would come in and it was an
Islamic exhibition and I remember you
know so many of them they would sit down
with us would give them Arabic coffee
and dates and have a chat with them and
they would say so many of them you'd be
surprised or maybe maybe we wouldn't be
surprised they would say I know Islam is
the truth Islam is the only religion
that actually makes sense but
my family but my friends but my Society
so many I've had I've had close
relatives without like naming and
shaming them on the show because that's
obviously private conversations who have
said
I believe
you know Islam but my father would never
take it or I believe in Islam but my
wife and my daughters and my social life
and we know that was like everybody the
prophet saws Uncle he knew the prophet
saws was the prophet he believed in his
prophecy he knew Islam was the truth but
he said how can I lead the way of the
quraish of My Tribe of my people and
that unfortunately is a
we see it multiplied all over the place
with so many people and that's just my
experience I mean you've probably come
across some other people and there's
probably so many viewers who are sitting
there now maybe watching this who aren't
even a Muslim are thinking deep down
yeah well I do believe Islam is the only
religion that actually makes sense but
it's just they don't follow up you know
um that is one of those things wow
that's really deep so from you've uh
from being in this position where you're
meeting so many people come into the
educational institute the dawa Center
exhibition there and you're sitting with
them eating having some dates coffee tea
whatever the case and they're telling
you they're telling you that we know
Islam is the truth submission to one and
only one God the creator of heavens and
earth
worshiping the Creator not the creation
this is the truth but then all these
excuses come into line
yeah definitely yeah more I mean I can't
even count how many times I mean I I
won't exaggerate and see everyone of
course not but you know that was it was
a regular occurrence you know where at
least for people at least the people
would say I mean you even had people who
would come in you know and start jumping
on like you know you can have four wives
and you can have this and I remember one
of them came in very very kind of like
not aggressive but kind of about the
four wives and of course we can't talk
about that now because it's a very long
topic but I broke it down and I said you
know if you look at the demographics or
the population there's more men than
women and that sometimes there's Wars
what happens to those weirdos and I went
into all different scenarios surprising
at the end she actually said to me well
you know what that actually makes
complete sense so she wasn't adamant you
could you could say coming from a very
feminist angle but when she lived she
actually said you know and all I did was
it's not because you know wow look at
the smile will look such a great orator
it was just literally I'm just talking
the facts you know and the evidences
that most of us know and she ended up
saying you know okay I can understand
where you're coming from it kind of
makes sense but and then she left she
said well I couldn't I could never let
my husband have a second wife so you
know you'd be surprised how many people
once you get the chance to speak to them
you know they actually realize that so
you know uh so many things make sense
but and that's why it's such a
responsibility for us as well and that's
amazing you know him that you've been
doing this kind of show for us it was
the best we can to pass on that message
to people that's all responsibility Upon
Us isn't it for us to pass on the
message and make them see the reality of
Islam and make them see the truth of
Islam as best as we can exactly yeah if
you care you share as I often say so
what would you advise people who are
like Andrew Tate just new to accepting
Islam you even have uh you can see a
video of him uh joking around with his
brother it's indirectly kind of giving
him some dawa I don't know if you've
seen that video oh yeah he's got to pay
tax and all this kind of stuff
yeah so uh what would you continue to
advise Andrew Tate or others who now
okay
um according to your experience and you
also knowing now that uh as you learn
you grow and now there's certain things
that you're gonna have to leave off and
how was that with you how hard difficult
was it at your at young age you learn
certain things your love for your
creator would grow also that fear of the
Creator's displeasure sure and now
certain things come up at what point do
you advise uh reverts converts and
applying that to yourself how
immediately or did it take time you know
how much time let's say a lot of there's
certain things that are very common
nowadays let's take for example uh
alcohol for instance you know
um
things come up and now you learn that I
gotta let pork go I gotta let this go
there's not too many in Islam there's
not too many things there's a few things
that are very harmful for the human
being and God Almighty out of his love
he had prohibited certain things so we
love the Creator we want to please the
Creator and now a river convert comes
across something that they love
you know and now they got a Jihad going
on a struggle with themselves how should
they go about this what do you advise
them
yeah definitely I mean that you know
like you mentioned there's going to be
things that they became accustomed to an
uh a point that I'd like to always
mention is you know people always focus
on and this is from our people's
weaknesses and definitely from the
caitanya from the Devil is point making
people think that everything is
forbidden in Islam and if we look at the
exactly and if we look at the if you
look at okay we can't have alcoholic
drinks but look at the you know the
variety of other amazing drinks that we
can drink we can't have pork and and
certain food like you know like finding
a dead carcass and eating it you know it
has to be sacrificed in a certain way
but that's in the in the bigger scale of
the picture that's literally like
everything on Earth apart from a very
small category of uh meat so and and
even when it comes to entertainment okay
we can't we shouldn't go night clubbing
and partying and smoking weed but look
at all the other amazing exciting
adrenaline stuff we can do you know like
like Jiu Jitsu for example so many
things we can do right but people always
focus on that was probably even five
percent of things are wrong so that's
one thing I'd like to point out for
those people who are you know who are
Muslims themselves thinking that or new
Muslims thinking like look oh no I
become a Muslim now everything is
forbidden or non-muslims think in the
same thing like if I become a Muslim I
have to become like a monk or you know a
Hermit and go and live in a cave
somewhere
um and in fact we know that living your
daily life in Islam it is worship you
know we were told that going about your
daily life and earning money and feeding
your wife and kids and giving to society
and being a good member of society is
considered worship and we're rewarded so
when it comes to becoming a Muslim it's
definitely something that needs to be
taken step by step and we do have a
problem with some Muslims they rush into
things you know or some or they try to
rush people into things so the guy
became a Muslim what's your name you
haven't changed your name how come you
haven't changed your name but there's no
emphasis on changing name I mean
Ali that was their name when they were
not Muslims they didn't change it we
know islamically the only reason you
have to change your name of course it's
nice to have a Muslim name to be
identified in you know amongst people as
a Muslim but my name is still officially
Lewis your name is Eddie you know I'm
known as Ismail but officially I'm Lewis
so there's no need for these kind of
things you know like rushing to change
your name as long as you don't have a
name that has a very has a negative
meaning or it has a meaning that you
worship something other than Allah then
there's no need to rush into things like
that even things like you know people uh
they have like you said they have vices
they they have alcohol we always tell
people it's better and this is a problem
and this is a big barrier that stops uh
people from becoming Muslim or maybe
even make some non-muslims kind of leave
Islam or feel like they're going to
leave Islam because they feel like
they're hypocritical or they say I can
never become a Muslim because I can
never wear a hijab or I can never give
up drink or I can't break up with my
girlfriend now of course we would never
encourage any of those acts but the fact
of the matter is if you become a Muslim
and you have a girlfriend you're sinful
but you're a Muslim
and if you look at the other flip side
of that would you rather realize the
truth and know that you need to become a
Believer but remain a disbeliever so if
you weigh that up what is the what is
the bigger sin to remain in denial of
your lord and disbelieving in him by not
making that final step you come to the
conclusion in your heart but making that
final word which was taught by all the
prophets as a condition to make the
final step or you're gonna uh You're
Gonna Keep you know give that up because
you you say I'm gonna still commit a
certain sin so this is very important
you know you can be a Muslim it's not
encouraging so don't anyone like clip
this now and say but the reality is if
someone said I want to become a Muslim
but I can't give up alcohol right now we
say to them become a Muslim But realize
alcohol is forbidden and this is
something you need to ASAP it's not a
license to keep on drinking for the rest
of your life but if someone we see you
know we seek refuge in that did become a
Muslim and drink for the rest of their
life
but they they became a Muslim you know
they they did the most important thing
they can do but they have like many
Muslims we know there are many Muslims
out there who have their problems some
of them may drink some of them may have
some of them may have girlfriends some
of them may do things they shouldn't do
but generally speaking they're obviously
still Muslim right we don't take them
out of the fold of Islam so this is very
important don't delay yourself becoming
a Muslim because you feel that you may
not be able to give certain things and
I'm not the best example because you
know Allah blessing me that became
Muslim so young so I didn't have a big
deep life of alcohol or you know women
or clubbing or whatever it may be but of
course you know living in the west until
I came out here and even in life there's
always Temptation so the the real
emphasis is you you've come to that
conclusion is to accept Islam and even
for the one who's become a Muslim it
will be difficult in the beginning and
you know maybe yourself and even the
shaytan and sometimes that the devil can
be in the form of himself whispering to
you it can be in the form of humans
acting like the devil you know coming
and saying to you like you know why did
you become a Muslim you know you're not
even a good one are you look you're
still drinking or you didn't break up
with your girlfriend you might as well
leave Islam so it's important not to
fall into these kind of doubts and
realize it's always better to be a
Muslim who has mistakes
than to be uh someone who recognizes the
truth and not to accept it because of
those mistakes this is very important
that we always like to you know point
out to people
uh it reminds me of one of the
companions uh these were the best also
men that walked the Earth who were
alongside the prophet Muhammad saw some
and one of them who also had a hard time
giving up alcohol you know the story
behind him right and but he was someone
who loved Allah God Almighty and the
messenger deeply and and he went through
his struggles at the end you know
yeah I mean as you're saying that comes
to my mind we're one of the companions
he came to the prophet behind peace upon
him and said allow me to fornicate allow
me to make dinner
and you know but this is this is also an
amazing thing because this count this
counts as the concept that you know in
modern term let's let's uh break that
down in modern like of vernacular like
uh allow me to hook up uh with the girls
like allow them to allow me yeah it just
yeah that pretty much equals to allow me
go to the club allow me to fulfill my
desires that's what he said you know
literally and well it's even more bad
because the word zinner literally means
to have you know to fornicate literally
it's like someone saying let me go and
you know without going into you know
vulgar modern terms but let me literally
go and have sex with a woman it's
literally you know and because well just
a disclaimer who's not my wife
of course yeah yeah definitely and one
thing that I wanna before I mentioned
the end of that what happened in that
scenario it just it just shows you
Encounters this evil and false narrative
that the prophet saws was a very harsh
and very you know elderly we don't even
want to repeat what people say but you
know the fact that he heard um such a
statement you know imagine now
unfortunately maybe someone even coming
to me and you you know we may lose our
temper and say brother you know you
crazy you know we'll go into maybe any
some of the imams in the mosque and the
guy this young guy goes and says can you
give me permission to you can imagine
the response so this is the prophet I
said the most religious
the most strict in the sense of the
correct strictness the balanced moderate
Middle Way path what was his reply he
just replied and said to him would you
uh would you approve of such a thing for
your mother or your sister or your
auntie and then the man realized you
know it made him kind of take a step
back and he and he said no so he said
also you know likewise people don't
approve of this for their mothers and
their daughters and their aunts so what
a beautiful response so this shows that
you know these are the best of people
and they had their own struggles and
their own mistakes no one from the
Muslims ever told them leave Islam
you're a hypocrite or don't become a
Muslim because we know you have an
alcohol problem and like you mentioned
one of the sahaba
um he was known that he kept you know
having this problem he'd make Toba he'd
feel bad he'd fall into the same mistake
he was never told to leave Islam he was
never called a hypocrite he was never
banished from the you know away from the
community you know in totality and these
kind of things so this is important you
know that you can this is a precedence
to show people that you may have
mistakes no one's perfect and that's why
the prophet Muhammad he mentioned in the
Hadith that all of the children of Adam
uh they make mistakes
and the best of those who are the ones
who repent
so this is this is it it's gonna it's
it's life so no one should like stop
themselves with coming becoming Muslim
because they feel that they're going to
be they're not going to be a perfect
Muslim I'll tell you something now there
are no perfect Muslims there's not a
perfect Muslim on the planet of the
Earth on the planet Perfection is only
to Allah so never anyone should think
that they're going to delay becoming
Muslim because they're not going to be
perfect everyone's different some will
practice at different levels but it's
that recognition you know you know why
would you not do it you know you're only
fooling yourself you're only kidding
yourself you're only betraying yourself
when you know deep down that Islam is
the truth and there is only one true God
and that's the only thing that makes
sense why delay it even if you can have
even if you can have mistakes that's
life you're gonna as they say you're on
the you're gonna fall off the bandwagon
you jump back on again you slip off you
keep on going it's life let's touch upon
that because what would Andrew Tate have
done because I mean this is uh somebody
who is the most Google man on the on the
planet and now people are like what he
accepted Islam what would he have to
have done to accept Islam let's break
that down let's spend a little bit time
going over that let's start with this
thing that you're talking about go ahead
and accept accept what what is it that I
have to say and do
it definitely you know the the main I
guess you could say Journey or the main
becoming a Muslim is the you know the
actual recognition so you're you know
you've come to that conclusion that
there's only one true God Allah because
Allah is the unique and personal name of
God it's not um you know God as we know
if you look in the dictionary now yes it
will tell you God is the word used for
Christian God but it will tell you
underneath and I think that's worship so
God is more of a description it's not a
personal name so his personal name is
Allah and this is the name that all the
prophets would have called him so when
the person they they you know which I
always say if anyone truly and I say
this in great confidence because you
know this and I know this if anybody
truly looks into Islam with an open mind
with all the pre-notions behind them all
the prejudices you know and they're
really sincerely want to find the truth
they can only come up with Islam it's
you know you know we may sound biased
but you know at one stage we weren't
Muslims so you know we can we can say
that with confidence we're not you know
we're not necessarily born Muslims
brought up all our lives in religious
Muslim families so we're bound to say
that no uh most of you know pretty much
all of my family are still non-muslims
but you know so when someone looks into
this they come to that conclusion there
is only one true God Allah and that only
he deserves to be worshiped the prophet
Muhammad doesn't deserve to be worshiped
Jesus Abraham Moses they were all humans
they were the best of mankind
the best examples of human beings but
they were not Gods themselves or the
sons of gods or parts of gods and you've
come to that conclusion and that the
prophet Muhammad was his last and final
messenger then you could say your
let's just you know for the sake of it
say you're 95 there that is the
essential that is the real part that you
need to come to and then the final step
is just literally professing what you're
saying somebody may say well I'll just
believe it and I won't say it
what we you know what we were told by
the prophet Muhammad and we see this
even through all the prophets they would
call their people to testify to Bear
Witness
so the final step to literally make you
a Muslim is when you you just literally
say you know you you say What's called
the shahada the testimony of faith and
this is the first pillar of Islam we
have five pillars of Islam and these
pillars are like the pillars in the
building in a building you know if you
want to have a structure that you can
call a stable and firm structure that
doesn't collapse
that you need these foundations these
pillars now those pillars of Islam are
this testimony the praying five times a
day they're giving annual charity if if
it's applicable to you which is a
certain amount of money that you have to
have saved away
uh the fasting month of Ramadan and once
your lifetime making the pilgrimage in
the footsteps of the prophet Abraham and
his son Ishmael and the Prophet Muhammad
in Mecca so these are the five pillars
and the most important one that brings
you into Islam is the shahada that
bearing witness or the testimony of
faith and that is literally where you
testify you say you say in Arabic
rasulullah
I testify that there is nothing worthy
of worship nothing no deity no God
nothing worthy of worship except Allah
and that the prophet Muhammad is his
last and final messenger and that is
exactly what Andrew take myself anyone
who becomes a Muslim they have to come
to that belief and make that statement
and then they have become a Muslim
something that's very important to
mention as well
and I'm not the best person to talk
about whether it's Andrew Tate whatever
it may be people's past like I said I
don't maybe follow so many influences
out there to know what they've done and
what they haven't done but one important
thing we must note for anyone out there
who thinks they've got so many bad
things they've done in the past is that
when you become a Muslim excuse me
when you become a Muslim
all your sins all of your sins are wiped
away
so it's like imagine you have a bank
account that's millions of dollars or
millions of pounds or Dirhams overdrawn
you're in big trouble
you become a Muslim that over that that
overdraft is canceled and not only is it
canceled if you continue to be a good
Muslim and you know your Islam becomes
strong all of those bad deeds in the
past are transferred to Good Deeds so
it's like you were billions of dollars
in overdrawn then it was wiped out and
then the bank kind of said hey what
you've been a good customer here's a
billions of dollars credit just like
that for nothing and of course to Allah
the best of examples so you can imagine
this what is what an amazing start that
is not only have you recognized your
creator stepped into the Islam which
means as you as many viewers know
submission that's what this Islam is not
named after uh a particular Nation
particular language a particular person
we're not called we're not
called arabianism and as we know most
the biggest Muslim populations in
Indonesia where Islam went there from
the good characteristics of the Muslim
Traders the people Embrace Islam
similarly we know that in you know
places like Bosnia when when the Muslims
came over there the Bosnian people were
already on this concept of of the
original message of Jesus of Jesus is
the the messenger of Allah but not Allah
himself so they accepted Islam so this
is you know this is what we see and this
is what people
um this is what they need to become a
Muslim it's just to accept that it's a
very simple process and this is where
you know the Journey Begins and your
life starts again and you know it's a
clean slate it's amazing
so if you're an Andrew Tate fan and you
want to know what he did that's what he
did he would have had to testify you
could do it right now
you see it's so easy it flows off the
tongue you're testifying that there's
nothing worthy of worship as our brother
had just so beautifully explained except
the one who created you the one who
created Jesus Moses Abraham the one who
created this whole universe and
everything in it you want to do it right
now go ahead and do it so this is
something that um beautiful subhanallah
tell me when you talked about that
you know some people sadly say you had
some Muslims how did you react to that
uh what's your advice some Muslims were
kind of upset that he actually accepted
Islam
yeah I mean like like I said you know
maybe I call coming on individual things
but maybe there were some things he may
have said that maybe we as Muslims don't
agree with
um but that's clear that's that's clear
I mean obviously it's we there's things
obviously that go against Islam we're
going to disagree at that right of
course but like I said we have to take
the perspective from as Muslims now now
it may be difficult for non-muslims
watching to say but I can I can never
forgive what he said here and what he
said there and I even had some people
reach out to me for my family or saying
like how could you even shake this guy's
hand whatever whatever it may be right
oh so you've had some personal
experiences like that huh yeah but
that's that's from non-muslim maybe
non-muslim relatives and stuff you know
because you know you have to understand
as well I guess it shouldn't be so much
for us as Muslims but from a non-muslim
perspective they don't understand this
concept some of them may not even
believe that there is there is a Creator
Unfortunately they don't have this
concept this amazing concept we have of
like repentance and and becoming a
Muslim wipes out what you did before
and you know we know that there were
companions who who became Muslim who
were Arch enemies of Islam they they
slaughtered Believers of Allah they
slaughtered sahaba in battle and they
wanted to kill the prophet Muhammad
peace upon him and they became Muslim
what is what is worse
whether it's whoever it may be what
could anyone done that's worse than
trying to kill a messenger of almighty
God killing his companions you know like
disciples killing them and then later
becoming a Muslim and being treated like
a brother and being treated like the
past is the past that's not an easy
thing can you imagine that I mean I want
people let that sink in let that sink in
for a moment
keep going that's just you know so so we
have we have to look at it for Muslims
that whatever he said in the past that
may have been very controversial or may
have gone you know I'm sure like anybody
who wasn't a Muslim would have said many
things that go against Islam we have to
realize that that was dead and we could
you know and uh we we cannot judge
someone by the past of course now if the
person whoever they may be continue
saying things against Islam then that
you know that's an issue and we have to
like you know it's fair enough we're
going to be disappointed or we're going
to say this is wrong but we can't you
know I heard some really crazy
statements uh you know I'm sure you I'm
sure I'm not the first to talk about
this but if it was going around and I
didn't see it myself but we heard so
many things like you know influence is
saying that I'm Gonna Leave Islam if he
became a Muslim I mean this is just like
really crazy I mean how can he how can
anyone say I'm going to leave Islam
Islam doesn't need you Islam doesn't
need Andrew Islam doesn't need me and
doesn't need any you know Islam is you
know Islam doesn't need anybody so you
know it's just really really crazy
statements you know so Islam is balance
so we don't go to we don't we don't
whoever becomes a Muslim we don't make
them to the status of like you know
almost like a prophet or like a super
the super you know authority of Islam or
as if they automatically become in our
eyes like we respect major Scholars no
but at the same time we don't judge them
upon the past we Islam as we know is
about
moderation
and we don't prophesy he'd always choose
moderation it matters so we have to say
such and such whoever it may be has
become a Muslim he may have had certain
things in the past that were bad may
Allah forgive him and we hope and we
make Dua that he will move on
but making crazy statements out there
like people even saying things like
would you be happy if Iran became a
Muslim uh yes anywhere
would you be happy if shaytan became a
True Believer uh yes you know it's
really really like crazy statements you
know like um will you be happy with
anyone you know accept the truth that's
an amazing thing so we have to take the
middle part of everything you know
especially in this matter
yeah that's a extremely extremely
important I mean obviously I mean this
is something that we got to go back to
the basics he or anyone else is not our
example the example is the prophet
Muhammad you have his companions you
have the righteous predecessors you have
people trying to live that model today
that we can take good from but if you
know the truth then you know those who
follow the truth and then human beings
are going to make mistakes you don't
follow human beings in those mistakes
you advise them to go back to who we
should be following it's very
straightforward and simple but a lot of
times uh people fall into making certain
celebrity people out there as their role
models that's not the right thing to do
is it
no definitely definitely and um it has
to be a balance you know whether there's
you know obviously if the celebrities uh
you know don't have a you know aren't
don't set a good example they're
definitely the right people to um to
follow but again we shouldn't it's very
important that we don't tie our Islam
into celebrities whether they're Muslims
celebrities who become Muslim or
non-muslim celebrities and you know
without mentioning names we all you know
I remember Muslims were very
um I wouldn't say addicted but to a
certain you know maybe a certain uh
psychologist from North America who says
a lot of good stuff when it comes to
this you know gender roles and and other
things and it has amazing stuff and I've
only watched very few of it to be honest
because I I don't find the time I like
to spend my time if I can spend my time
uh you know listen to Scholars lectures
and what have you but I've come across
some of these and I felt you know very
very good words were being said but some
Muslims made it as if they need these
people
to prove what Islam is all about and
when that person may come out and say I
have advice for Muslims and and sound
patronizing everyone's like oh no oh no
as if this person is like an Islamic
scholar or something so we we have to
remember that we don't our religion is
not based on you know celebrities and we
have to always do everything everything
in moderation literally so even if
you're gonna look up to somebody who who
may have some good content whether
Muslim or not Muslim again it's in
moderation because you never know what
come the next day so if you bathe if you
base your faith or your beliefs on an
individual person
uh apart from obviously the prophet saws
as the as the companion then the the
seller for the uh piouses of the past
they said you know like everyone's
statement is accepted and rejected
except the the person in the grave
pointing to the prophesy some grave so
he's the only one that we can you know
ultimately follow and uh and take as our
100 role model
uh just quickly going back to uh your
story real quick uh before we conclude a
few more questions did you have a
Affinity towards Jesus as a Christian at
that time were you stuck on the concept
that he died for your sins and now was
that something hard to let go uh the
Trinity for example how did you battle
with these things after and right before
accepting Islam
good question I mean I I to be to be
quite honest I can't say that I had this
this concept of dying for the sins was
really like you know
you know embred in me so much that it
was really hard to be honest when I read
about Islam
and I saw this concept
uh that you know God could only be one
and he doesn't have any sons or Partners
or there's no intermediary if you you
don't need to confess to anybody if you
make a sin you confess to him he's all
here they're all see and all loving
they're all merciful all of the
descriptions to be honest I was just
convinced to be quite honest with you
um so it's very hard as well to remember
because we're talking now you know I'm
now 45 so we're talking about
31 years ago or 30 31 years ago when I
embraced Islam I don't remember really
struggling as such uh from that
perspective I think that I was just so
convinced with the the this concept of
the monotheism true monotheism that you
cannot find anywhere else that that it
just kind of taken over everything else
in the sense of that and and pushed me
forward to um you know to make that
decision and become a Muslim so I don't
think I had much of a struggle in that
sense because I was just so convinced by
that concept
that I I relate to that because that's
something that really once you get to
know the pure monotheism the toe heat
it's so powerful it just dominates it
just takes over everything out there and
it clears up any doubts or anything so I
cannot stress how important it is to
really know your tawheed to really know
because this is what everything else if
this is strong I cannot forget at one
time when I did my first Hajj
and back in 2006 and I was visiting with
one scholar there and he ended up being
sick you know how in the 10 cities there
and a lot of people end up getting uh
some people get sick while they're there
and I went to see him and we were
expecting to have a long you know advice
for maybe 20 minutes 30 and he just two
words like and this was in Bosnian he
said hold on to tawheed
and that to this day stuck with me
because when you hold on to this this is
your salvation this is what will get you
into Jannah this is what if you let go
you lose it then you end up in the in
the Hellfire what are your comments on
that
yeah definitely I mean that's that is
the key that is the fundamental thing
and that's why you know when I mentioned
earlier about those people who have
recognized that to not hold back because
that is the essential thing you know you
could struggle you could slip up you
could fall into some sins you could you
know all these things could happen but
when you have that firm belief of
monotheism and you know deep down that's
the only thing that makes sense this is
literally like you said this is the
foundation of of your life this is this
is a foundation of our existence as we
know in the Quran people who wander
around saying what's the purpose of life
and coming out with whack statements
like YOLO and all this nonsense of
course YOLO you only live once we
actually believe that in the sense of in
this in this worldly life you only live
once you better make the right decisions
but of course there is the you know the
second life there ever you know
everlasting life and we find people
wandering around not knowing what their
real purpose of life is and you and I'm
sure you know and you ask people they
come out with all kinds of different
things and it says in the Quran you know
that Allah created the spirit life and
Mankind to worship him alone and another
verse he mentions that he created life
and death to see which is best of you in
actions so you know this is our purpose
in life this is why we're here to
recognize our Lord to worship Him of
course we can live a life you know we
can still live a very happy life a very
modern life within the boundaries and as
we mentioned earlier what's not allowed
to do and what is allowed to do 95 of
things you can do five percent things
you can't do so you can live a you know
a normal happy life but why would you
not accept and recognize your lord and
like I said anybody out there it's a
challenge when we know that we even say
to them
put your three Notions behind
pray and say to almighty God that you
want the truth and if you
you can't come to any conclusion I mean
we could talk about this with the
evidence of Islam and we could you do
this every week but this is just
something that you know if you're really
looking for it you cannot deny it's 100
Islam no doubt about it you'll come
inshallah to that conclusion of course
if that's written for you as well
yeah and obviously then everything else
Builds on that uh developing your
character you know the your moral uh
Integrity all these things start to grow
grow and it goes back to what we started
with seeking knowledge you know like you
you would uh what was the key for you
now also obviously you sought a lot of
knowledge sitting with Scholars and
whatnot for 30 years you know and what
I've seen a lot of times people who will
fall off they'll fall off because they
didn't seek knowledge they didn't
Implement what God Almighty Allah told
them to implement they followed their
desires and then what happens you fall
in the traps of shaytan and then you end
up deviating you get lost you get
misguided so let's just talk about
briefly like 30 years now and to get
where you're at what was the key to that
uh well no doubt you know I've had my
ups and downs and you know periods where
we we may fall into those periods of uh
not being um you know a studious or as
good as we can but you know there has to
be it has to be consistency and like you
said
um the more you learn so you the person
needs to be learning they need to be
um doing their best to to seek knowledge
you know you may have a period of time
where you get very busy but you should
never you know completely leave off that
journey of knowledge you know it's a
lifelong journey you know even even as
we know the the greatest of Scholars we
hear about them like learning and
studying and until they literally you
know until they died some of them you
know maybe died while they're writing
books you know so this is it's an it's
an ongoing journey and you know I don't
want to say that I'm a great example I'm
probably one of the very basic of
examples there's so many people out
there who have really taken it taken it
to another level but you know you just
have to keep seeking no knowledge
whatever it may be you know a lot of the
time now we're driving around in our
cars this is a perfect time you know you
can't you're not that kind of studious
guy who goes to the Masjid and writes
notes listen to something in your car
because you're going to walk away with
some benefit and you know and being with
good people we know the famous Hadith
the prophet Muhammad said a good
companion is like the the musk seller
that you know either he's going to give
you some of his perfume some of his musk
or you're going to walk away smelling
nice and then he gave the example of the
bad companion that the bad companion is
like the one who is a blacksman either
he's going to burn you with the Sparks
are coming off or you're gonna leave
with that horrible burnt Smoky smell and
this is reality so the more you're with
good people the more you're gonna it's
gonna impact you and the more you're
gonna wanna do things like seek
knowledge and do good deeds
um so it's basically it's it's a it's a
it's an ongoing Journey that you need to
uh need to take and there's so many
headies that we two even two too many to
mention but one that always amazes me is
those people
who on the Yoma
were destined to on the day of judgment
were destined to you know maybe they
were Muslims but they were sinful so
they were destined to go you know and
taste some of the punishment of the
Hellfire to cleanse them of their sins
uh and they will the angels will
mentioned to Allah and of course Allah
knows everything
that these were the people
that sat in circles of knowledge so
these weren't the actual students of
knowledge the real studious ones but
they used to go to the Masjid the mosque
if they sat at the back kind of half
listening half not listening but they
they still went there right they still
went to these they could have been at
the clubs they could have been out
partying but they're in the mosque even
though they're not really dedicated to
really serious students but they're in
these sittings that it will be said that
these other people or these are the
Gatherings that those who were in them
uh you know that they will that they
were basically they will be saved you
know so this will take them out of the
punishment so just if you can
do your best to even attend these kind
of um Circles of knowledge the reward is
amazing and like I said it's an up and
down Journey I'm definitely not the best
example at all but it's an up and down
Journey sometimes you'll be more
studious than others sometimes you may
take a break of years where you feel a
bit it's very offer on and off but then
you come back again and that's life it's
a and that's what we say about everyone
you know we said so many times in this
episode you're thinking of becoming a
Muslim you think you're not going to be
good enough you're never going to be
perfect you're going to make mistakes
you're going to slip it's about starting
the journey and continuing it's like
life how many times you have ups and
downs in life you have a job you get
fired you have a job you lose your job
you have a house you have a car you have
a car crash your car breaks down your
car catches fire whatever it may be your
faith may be like that but it's about
staying on you don't genuine people who
don't give up on life they just go ahead
and they continue and that's what you've
got to do when it comes to Islam comes
accepting the truth and continuing on
the truth and seeking knowledge as well
I have a good feeling here that uh Dubai
right now is a hot spot you've got a lot
of celebrities you got a lot of
Americans non-americans just people from
all over the globe visiting Dubai and I
had a good feeling out there watch this
program they're going to want to come
into this uh that was sent to
Educational Center where Andrew Tate
came to learn go ahead and tell us if
they want to go ahead and meet you and
they're in Dubai and want to stop by and
get some more information honestly tell
us about that before we conclude what
what is an amazing a couple of projects
we have as well before I before I give
contact information is that we actually
have mosquitoes where we uh we tourists
are coming in and we're coming they come
into the Moscow or explain to them that
the essential of Islam you know the five
pillars of Islam this testimony of Faith
who explains them what is the mosque and
why do we pray and what is prayer who do
we pray to so this is and this is
received very well we get a lot of
tourists really enjoying it we have a
project where we have in all the hotels
in Dubai and most of the whole country
actually in everything single hotel room
is a beautifully translated designed
copy of the Quran
first of a Time in the World actually
it's the first time that we're aware of
in the world where on you know the scale
of a of a country or most of the country
or a whole massive City like Dubai and
the surrounding cities
uh have a Quran in every single hotel
room and we get a lot of positive
response people are calling us
you know you know are telling us we want
to take a copy with us and they're
ordering from us copies we deliver to
their hotel room European American
tourists are taking these qurans back
with them
um and of course anybody who's in Dubai
or visits Dubai and they want to reach
out to us they can get us at Islamic
ic.com that's the best format or on
social media where Islamic icdxb
um on Instagram and uh and Facebook and
they can reach out to us and we can take
them on one of these free Moss tours
it's free they get a nice tour they get
some emirati you could say traditional
kind of breakfast Hospitality snacks and
we give them a very nice uh tour of some
of them you know one of the most
beautiful mosques right in the Dubai
Marina which is a very big tourist Hot
Spot anyway everybody it's a bit like
Monte Carlo the the way it looks the
beautiful Marina with the boats
um yeah and we're more than willing to
do that for them and of course anybody
else around the world who also wants to
reach out so we we have sometimes
surprisingly enough people from the
States from around the world maybe they
feel a bit apprehensive to go to a local
mosque so they end up reaching out to us
and sometimes they become a muslim with
us and then we try to direct them into a
nearer after that to a center so you
know it will open for everybody in that
sense we anyone could reach out tell
them the dean show sent you and keep us
posted on that that'll be interesting uh
let us know how that goes I'm sure
inshallah I will and some people will
come in there and uh tell them again
that we sent you from the dean show you
saw him on the dean show and uh stop by
and visit there in Dubai brother thank
you very much for sharing that uh some
of the highlights there of meeting with
Andrew Tate and also your story coming
to this day
it's been a pleasure brother thank you
Brothers
I cannot leave without giving you a gift
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1-800-662-4752 we'll see you next time
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